The 7A at larger apertures has a bit of the Black Mist filter look, smaller DoF than the CV 75 at the same aperture, no noticeable field curvature and smoother bokeh. It's almost twice the weight though, harder to focus and has poor flare resistance (not particularly attractive flare either), which is why I got the CV 75 in the first place. I'm hoping that the Black Mist filters can even out the differences somewhat, so that I can sell 7A 75. We'll see.
Helena, your postings on flickr using the 7A gave me the incentive to pick up a copy, after getting the VM 75, which was added to a Summarit 75. I've opted to keep them all : - ). There aren't any FC issues on an M or Z. It would be nice if there was a 7/TTA image thread for M glass, here...
Back in Sept 2020 I asked in this thread about an upcoming E mount version of this lens. Some speculated that Cosina makes announcements in late Feb and we might see something then, and I have been patiently waiting for 6 months, but that time frame and come and gone. Has anyone heard any updates on an E mount version of the 75mm f1.5 Nokton?
Cosina will know by now what the reception to 'Vintage' lens will be among Sony users. My guess is they are aligning the E mount lenses to serve both M and E users. Only the 21/3.5 (Vintage) and the 35/1.4 (Classic) in the M mount lineup made it to the E lens listing, out of the current offerings. The 21/3.5 is a Vintage for the same reason the 50/3.5 is - design and slow aperture. The 35/1.4 was an idea they floated, most likely, one they would not repeat.
You see, just as we are learning how they think, they also are trying to anticipate market receptivity. They are small time, still seeking distributors in parts of the world. Over time, people here will get a better read on what the 75/1.5 can do for their work and if it is sufficient.
It might be rendered moot if an APO-Lanthar in the portrait range comes along, and that could build on the VM 35/50 pair as well, where the hard work was done. But the fast 75mm is more capable than is generally understood, extraordinary bokeh in a less technical lens. I've seen some fine B/W images from it, in keeping with the Vintage categorisation.
philip_pj wrote:
Cosina will know by now what the reception to 'Vintage' lens will be among Sony users. My guess is they are aligning the E mount lenses to serve both M and E users. Only the 21/3.5 (Vintage) and the 35/1.4 (Classic) in the M mount lineup made it to the E lens listing, out of the current offerings. The 21/3.5 is a Vintage for the same reason the 50/3.5 is - design and slow aperture. The 35/1.4 was an idea they floated, most likely, one they would not repeat.
You see, just as we are learning how they think, they also are trying to anticipate market receptivity. They are small time, still seeking distributors in parts of the world. Over time, people here will get a better read on what the 75/1.5 can do for their work and if it is sufficient.
It might be rendered moot if an APO-Lanthar in the portrait range comes along, and that could build on the VM 35/50 pair as well, where the hard work was done. But the fast 75mm is more capable than is generally understood, extraordinary bokeh in a less technical lens. I've seen some fine B/W images from it, in keeping with the Vintage categorisation. ...Show more →
Thank you for this Philip. I would welcome the faster "vintage" 75 f1.5 because it is smaller and lighter in keeping with what I want to pair up with it, my 21mm f3.5 CS and the new 35mm f2 APO. So for that reason, I also would also welcome a 75mm APO lens, unless it was sized like the 65 APO f2, which is too big for me and weighs almost double the 75 f1.5. I want a smaller and lighter 3 lens set, so here is hoping they do release a E mount version of the 75 f1.5 or an APO version with a weight under 400g.
We put our heads and try to figure these guys out. I truly think they enjoy their relative seclusion from fame and enjoy dropping their lenses with such little fanfare. It's going to become a glaring hole soon - the 75-90mm 'zone of need'.
philip_pj wrote:
It might be rendered moot if an APO-Lanthar in the portrait range comes along, and that could build on the VM 35/50 pair as well, where the hard work was done. But the fast 75mm is more capable than is generally understood, extraordinary bokeh in a less technical lens. I've seen some fine B/W images from it, in keeping with the Vintage categorisation.
I regard a 75mm APO-Lanthar in both M- and E-mounts as more likely than an E-mount version of the Nokton 75/1.5. I have the VM 75/1.5 and would exchange it without hesitation for an APO 75.
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philip_pj wrote:
We put our heads and try to figure these guys out. I truly think they enjoy their relative seclusion from fame and enjoy dropping their lenses with such little fanfare. It's going to become a glaring hole soon - the 75-90mm 'zone of need'.
Phillip, which do you think is more likely to be addressed: the 75-90mm 'zone of need' or the 28mm ‘chasm of desperation’?
You would need to be able to fly to a place we cannot go. From tea leaves, I feel they will actually do better with the portrait lens area, they are an easier design and they would bring something special to such a lens, it would be light and very versatile too. They for sure listen to feedback, via dealers and (most likely) across the informed forums, the Leica ones plus here essentially.
Wide end they have 10-12-15-21-21-35-35-40, it's not bad seen from their vantage point. Longer than 50mm it's heavy macros only or M mount repurposed lenses. Or as Fred tried, the (DSLR) 90/3.5. So that is a lot of gain for less work and less competition, low hanging fruit for sales.
David and 1joel1 here want f2.8, but my take is it has to be f2, mainstream people turn off manual focus lenses slower than that (example: Loxia 85/2.4), plus Leica has pioneered the concept, it's in both SL and M now. And they can sell the range easily: 35-50-75(?) all at f2, all 350-375 grams or so for Sony.
The trend is greater complexity, Sigma's very good 65/2 is 12/9 where the Loxia 85, the VM 75/1.5 and Leica's 75/2 APO M are seven element lenses. So a 10/8 or so would do nicely for such a lens.
Leica's M 75/2 APO is 430 grams and has the usual overbuilt construction and built in hood. The new glass greatly assists small lenses to stay small via double-sided asph elements. 75mm gives them easier access to M users too, using the same basic design, due to ease of focusing - important for high end lenses (as you well know!). It's easier to showcase their novel round aperture at a longer FL too.
philip_pj wrote:
Leica's M 75/2 APO is 430 grams and has the usual overbuilt construction and built in hood. The new glass greatly assists small lenses to stay small via double-sided asph elements. 75mm gives them easier access to M users too, using the same basic design, due to ease of focusing - important for high end lenses (as you well know!). It's easier to showcase their novel round aperture at a longer FL too.
I had decided to replace my Nokton VM 75/1.5 with a used APO-Summicron-M 75/2 but someone else bought it while I was dithering. An APO-Lanthar 75/2 would allow me to get a superior lens at about a third the cost of the Leica lens.
philip_pj wrote:
It might be rendered moot if an APO-Lanthar in the portrait range comes along, and that could build on the VM 35/50 pair as well, where the hard work was done.
genji wrote:
I regard a 75mm APO-Lanthar in both M- and E-mounts as more likely than an E-mount version of the Nokton 75/1.5. I have the VM 75/1.5 and would exchange it without hesitation for an APO 75.
And just like that, the next day Cosina released a patent for a 75mm APO Lanthar lens. Along with 2 APO 135mm lenses at f2 and f1.2, see photorumours dot com March 20th.
SpecFoto wrote:
And just like that, the next day Cosina released a patent for a 75mm APO Lanthar lens. Along with 2 APO 135mm lenses at f2 and f1.2, see photorumours dot com March 20th.
Please starting wishing for a 28 and 100/2 as well
These look like generalised design sketches, and they date from '[Application date] September 12, 2019'. But - they may offer insights into Cosina's thinking over the recent period. All are shown as nine element designs (maybe as an anchor for the patent?), but the real life 50/2 APOs are 10 element designs and the 35/2 APOs are 11 elements. One looks suspiciously like the VM 75/1.5 with an extra cemented pair at the rear end.
A lot these ideas never go anywhere, but a 135/2, a 25/2 and a new f2-ish 75mm, that is interesting and there is room for them all. The 135/1.2 looks 'out there' - a long character portrait lens? A 40/2 APO is surely redundant and will gather dust.
But 25/2? Well, Leica went with a 28/2 and a 21/2 in SL, both APOs. So maybe, and it is a venerable focal length consistently used by Zeiss: ZM-ZEF-Batis-Milvus etc. I could see that one happening in mirrorless times, with even more APD/asph surfacing to constrain its size. Its full FOV indicates a true FL of 25.9mm - near enough is good enough? They started their journey with Sony with ultra wides and they are very well-regarded, as per the Voigtlander image page.
And this was published just now, two days ago. The lenses might even offer 'sufficient optical performance in a shooting lens in a wide-angle range to a medium telephoto range'.
The advice Fred gave about shooting this lens with the aperture right between f/1.5 and f/2 is spot-on. The bokeh stays the same, but the IQ jumps considerably.
EXIF not shown since I forgot to change the lens profile from the last lens I used.
highdesertmesa wrote:
The advice Fred gave about shooting this lens with the aperture right between f/1.5 and f/2 is spot-on. The bokeh stays the same, but the IQ jumps considerably.
EXIF not shown since I forgot to change the lens profile from the last lens I used.
f/1.7 is good enough to clear up some SA at close distance. I wish there was an aperture click there. Lovely image!
It does some special stuff right at the transition zone. Some prefer f2 as their preferred point of compromise, both work well and it will vary by taste (and resolution too). People really want bite in their portrait lenses these days.
philip_pj wrote:
It does some special stuff right at the transition zone. Some prefer f2 as their preferred point of compromise, both work well and it will vary by taste (and resolution too). People really want bite in their portrait lenses these days.
I realize I am a dying breed here, but I want less micro contrast and sharpness and smoother rendering than the CV typically delivers. I have been playing with different diffusion filters to liking on the CV 75/1.5 with great success (to my liking). Images have a much different feel when processed mindfully.
Fred Miranda wrote:
f/1.7 is good enough to clear up some SA at close distance. I wish there was an aperture click there. Lovely image!
Thank you! I thought the same thing about wishing we had aperture clicks between the existing ones.
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philip_pj wrote:
It does some special stuff right at the transition zone. Some prefer f2 as their preferred point of compromise, both work well and it will vary by taste (and resolution too). People really want bite in their portrait lenses these days.
I tried both 1.7 and 2, and here's what I saw (for a near-MFD subject):
1.7 = Almost no change in bokeh rendering versus 1.5. Substantial jump in clarity (reduction of SA as FM says above).
2 = Noticeable reduction in bokeh blur. Increase in the depth of field, small increase in sharpness.
Agree it's purpose, content, and taste dependent as to which way to go. I even like the rendering at 2.8 for close subjects with a lot of texture detail.
nehemiahphoto wrote:
I realize I am a dying breed here, but I want less micro contrast and sharpness and smoother rendering than the CV typically delivers. I have been playing with different diffusion filters to liking on the CV 75/1.5 with great success (to my liking). Images have a much different feel when processed mindfully.
Very film-like rendering. Reminds me I need to order a Black Pro Mist 1/4 in 58 and 52mm for the CV lenses I've bought recently.
highdesertmesa wrote:
Very film-like rendering. Reminds me I need to order a Black Pro Mist 1/4 in 58 and 52mm for the CV lenses I've bought recently.
The one above with shot with a 1 in overcast light. I have a 1/2 as well, which is a little more neutral and does better in contrasty and harsher light. I don't want to spam the thread, but I have been using them more on the 35i, and they've been great. Mostly a 1/2 on the CV--the 1/8 doesn't really alter the feel of the image.
The wider lenses require less powerful numbers to get the same affect. Wonderfully, the Sigma 35i and CV 75/1.5 share the 58mm filter thread. I am enjoying the IQ effect so much, I've order another one or two of different types. I think I'll be able to get a very attractive Summilux like look on the CV but with smoother structural rendering, smaller size and about 3k cheaper Excited to try out one or two of the new filter on the CV 75. And, when I want egregious amounts of fine detail resolution, which this lens has in spades--wow, I stop it down and it's incredible. All with the CV 75
