I'm glad monopods have come in this latest discussion, as I was think about asking about whether they make sense for a safari. I found that using a monopod on a cruise ship didn't work very well due the engine vibration, so I wasn't sure if there would be a similar problem on a safari. Of course that was 10 years ago when I didn't have very many lenses with image stabilization.
I'd be interested in whether folks find a monopod useful on a safari, and when and how you use it.
vbnut wrote:
I'm glad monopods have come in this latest discussion, as I was think about asking about whether they make sense for a safari. I found that using a monopod on a cruise ship didn't work very well due the engine vibration, so I wasn't sure if there would be a similar problem on a safari. Of course that was 10 years ago when I didn't have very many lenses with image stabilization.
I'd be interested in whether folks find a monopod useful on a safari, and when and how you use it.
when the light gets low it helps stabilize if you have nothing to brace things against. No worried about engine vibrations because the engines are always off once you pull up and park it. you may notice that your vehicle mates are more the issue shifting weight than anything.
vbnut wrote:
I'm glad monopods have come in this latest discussion, as I was think about asking about whether they make sense for a safari. I found that using a monopod on a cruise ship didn't work very well due the engine vibration, so I wasn't sure if there would be a similar problem on a safari. Of course that was 10 years ago when I didn't have very many lenses with image stabilization.
I'd be interested in whether folks find a monopod useful on a safari, and when and how you use it.
Everyone is different but I would say I'm handheld 90% of the time and 10% resting on something, including the ground. I've never used a bean bag there other than one time shooting out the roof and that was a result of us waiting for a leopard to come down a tree. Of my 90% handheld probably 90% of that is letting the camera/lens hang from the lens foot locked at the 12' o'clock position.. Most all of this is being done either lying down or on the knees, so it's often awkward positioning. It all depends on how low you can get and the vegetation will often dictate that.
A lot of this depends on the type of vehicle and how many people you are sharing it with. If you don't have a vehicle full of other people you can move around freely and hang out the side. I also like to get out of the vehicle as much as possible, but this depends on your relationships with your guides and how comfortable they are with you.
There are people that use monopods to hang their camera near the ground and then shoot off a remote shutter. Tin Man Lee has done it, so has Steve Mattheis. Apparently a lot of rangers will stop you from doing this now.
guitardirky wrote:
when the light gets low it helps stabilize if you have nothing to brace things against. No worried about engine vibrations because the engines are always off once you pull up and park it. you may notice that your vehicle mates are more the issue shifting weight than anything.
Haha, exactly..... "Don't move, don't make a sound, and actually, don't breathe!"
artsupreme wrote:
Haha, exactly..... "Don't move, don't make a sound, and actually, don't breathe!"
Yes, the biggest problem I have always noted is not the vehicle but the people inside it. There is no way to counter that except to shout 'moving' when you have to get that SD card from the bag or change cameras and hope people are able to adjust accordingly. Movement at the wrong time can completely ruin your shot no matter how steady your system is. Some Pros I've been with will yell at whoever moved in rather colorful language.
One other problem I've had with non-photographers, esp newbies and family is excessive chatter and that too rather loud. One time I was doing a video of vultures feeding on a carcass and they make this very otherwordly chittering sound that I wanted to record. My family in the vehicle with me kept talking and I had to repeatedly tell them to give me exactly one minute of silence. Do you know, it was impossible for them to stay quiet even for one minute. It was frustrating as hell. But you can't really yell at your wife now can you? :-)
I was in the Serengeti and Ngorongoro Crater last year, ancient tripod, modern ball head and Promedia Gear GT2. A9 - GN 100-400 occasionally with 1.4, Used tripod to take load and GT2 to change height and angle. Also A7III with 28-200mm.
One other m4/3 camera and mobile phone each. We generally got the photos we could.
artsupreme wrote: guitardirky wrote:
when the light gets low it helps stabilize if you have nothing to brace things against. No worried about engine vibrations because the engines are always off once you pull up and park it. you may notice that your vehicle mates are more the issue shifting weight than anything.
Haha, exactly..... "Don't move, don't make a sound, and actually, don't breathe!"[/quote
Re: vehicle mates: when there are 3 shooters, the noise, movement and non-readiness level will go up a bunch, even when they are your buddies. For eyes wide open or the anticipated head bump, etc., you need to be shooting the second the engine is turned off. A monopod is a nice to have - especially for leopards up in trees or when waiting for cheetahs to begin the chase - but there are work arounds if you can’t handhold your rig steady while in awkward positions like many of the strong guys (jealous) in this forum. In Ndutu Conservation, we’re not allowed to hang out or sit on top anymore and 2 years ago, a shooter was laying on the floor with his big white hanging out. Sure ‘nuff, BAM! a male lion sneaked around and knocked his rig from his hand. That was bad in more ways than one.
ChrisHA wrote:
Re: vehicle mates: when there are 3 shooters, the noise, movement and non-readiness level will go up a bunch, even when they are your buddies. For eyes wide open or the anticipated head bump, etc., you need to be shooting the second the engine is turned off. A monopod is a nice to have - especially for leopards up in trees or when waiting for cheetahs to begin the chase - but there are work arounds if you can’t handhold your rig steady while in awkward positions like many of the strong guys (jealous) in this forum. In Ndutu Conservation, we’re not allowed to hang out or sit on top anymore and 2 years ago, a shooter was laying on the floor with his big white hanging out. Sure ‘nuff, BAM! a male lion sneaked around and knocked his rig from his hand. That was bad in more ways than one.
Agreed, even if there's just one other person in the vehicle like your significant other and just the guide you still have to regulate and tell them both to sit still and be silent. As for tripods and monopods, I lugged them over there more than once and never ended up using them but I could see how some people would like them, especially if they have a full vehicle and can't move around much.
That's crazy about the male lion, but I know stuff like that happens. My last trip I was lying down and hanging my upper body outside the vehicle totally inverted with my 100-300 in hand. Only my stomach and legs inside the door. A big male lion locked onto me and started coming right at me. Seeing through the LCD he was getting very close, I lifted my head and locked eyes with him only to see him continue to march straight toward me about 15ft away. He continued his game of chicken, staring me down, and luckily made a last minute turn no more than 6ft in front of my face. He could have easily grabbed my head with his jaws and yanked me out of the vehicle for dessert but I guess it was not my time. Even if I wanted to move I wasn't able to because of my inverted positioning. Quite the rush.
Isaac specializes in birding tours, but since he grew up walking Serengeti and Ngorongoro herding cattle - he knows mammals just as well. Isaac is from the Arusha area, and knows Tanzania best...but he has also led tours in Kenya and Uganda. He shoots Nikon digital...and uses Zeiss binoculars. In the photo below I'll let you guess who is Isaac, and who is Deborah and me from NYC.
artsupreme wrote:
Agreed, even if there's just one other person in the vehicle like your significant other and just the guide you still have to regulate and tell them both to sit still and be silent. As for tripods and monopods, I lugged them over there more than once and never ended up using them but I could see how some people would like them, especially if they have a full vehicle and can't move around much.
That's crazy about the male lion, but I know stuff like that happens. My last trip I was lying down and hanging my upper body outside the vehicle totally inverted with my 100-300 in hand. Only my stomach and legs inside the door. A big male lion locked onto me and started coming right at me. Seeing through the LCD he was getting very close, I lifted my head and locked eyes with him only to see him continue to march straight toward me about 15ft away. He continued his game of chicken, staring me down, and luckily made a last minute turn no more than 6ft in front of my face. He could have easily grabbed my head with his jaws and yanked me out of the vehicle for dessert but I guess it was not my time. Even if I wanted to move I wasn't able to because of my inverted positioning. Quite the rush. ...Show more →
Yikes - It's bad enough when they fake like they're not staring you down and want you to think that they could care less about you as they sneak peeks out of the corner of their eyes. But for you to be dangling out in limbo with a direct stare down, well that's a heart stopper IMHO ~/~
This set up for the 600mm f4TC and a beanbag is far as I would go for support. I can’t lug around a tripod or monopod.
artsupreme wrote:
Agreed, even if there's just one other person in the vehicle like your significant other and just the guide you still have to regulate and tell them both to sit still and be silent. As for tripods and monopods, I lugged them over there more than once and never ended up using them but I could see how some people would like them, especially if they have a full vehicle and can't move around much.
That's crazy about the male lion, but I know stuff like that happens. My last trip I was lying down and hanging my upper body outside the vehicle totally inverted with my 100-300 in hand. Only my stomach and legs inside the door. A big male lion locked onto me and started coming right at me. Seeing through the LCD he was getting very close, I lifted my head and locked eyes with him only to see him continue to march straight toward me about 15ft away. He continued his game of chicken, staring me down, and luckily made a last minute turn no more than 6ft in front of my face. He could have easily grabbed my head with his jaws and yanked me out of the vehicle for dessert but I guess it was not my time. Even if I wanted to move I wasn't able to because of my inverted positioning. Quite the rush. ...Show more →
berimbolo wrote:
Filler may be an issue. You should ask the lodges you're staying at before going. If you will be in a photography-adjusted vehicle, it may have built in bean bags to use. I filled a bag up and took it with me. Filled with buckwheat hulls. I used the Lenscoat something pro. It was fine. I still use it in place of buying a ground pod.
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ChrisHA wrote:
My primary beanbag is the Skimmersack II molar bag for shooting out of windows (95% of the time ‘cause it’s lower to ground/more comfy on shoulders, etc.). The larger Kinesis is used to wedge into the railings. I also use a Skimmer/RRS monohead on top of the skimmersack for smoother panning, speed/stability and a place to wrap a remote cable when used for reduced vibration.
I also bring a smaller molar for the other side the vehicle for speed (old GuraGear/WildlifeImages) as well as several SafariSacks - large and small - for protecting rigs from banging into each other/doors and as spares when they got lost on bumpy drives. In TZ, I buy beans/fill bags in Karatu. Sorry, I don’t know the situation in Kenya.
In roll bar type vehicles, I lean a monopod/monohead against the skimmersack draped over the bar. This is more stable and allows me to shoot 90 degrees left/right when needed.
Prior to TZ, I requested seed/rice WAY in advance of my visit albeit they were the pricier camps that I don’t do anymore (cost/don’t like moving camp:camp). When using puddle jumpers, I packed flax/buckwheat but it took precious packing space.
Seed/rice work best IMHO. Beans are heavier and can stress fabric seams. I only had one SkimmerSack II rip in all of these years which is why I always have duct/Tenacious tape with me.
Always return this precious commodity back to the camp or give to your driver.
Lastly, if you leave Kinesis bags up on the rail, bring shoestrings/cord to tie them down.
artsupreme wrote:
I would hope your camp has beanbags as I've never been to a camp who doesn't have them. If for some reason one of your camps doesn't have them, there are plenty of blankets, cushions, personal clothing, etc that work just fine to sit your lens on the side rail. You might not be using beanbags much if you are one who's always trying to get as low as possible.
I would check with your camp before bringing a beanbag over there.
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berimbolo wrote:
I didn't use the bean bag very often for stills. Mostly for video. For stills, I hung myself over the side of the vehicle so that I could get a lower perspective.
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Primus wrote:
I've not taken a bean bag to Kenya in many years. Most camps and tour operators will provide the molar type bags in every vehicle, 2 per row so you have one for each side. The vehicles with roll bars are usually padded enough for one to rest a lens on.
For the 200-600 I've never needed a bean bag, and I am a small guy. I try to lean out and lower my hands to get a lower perspective - or shoot out the open side door if I am in the front row and the others do not object. For the new 300 you may need one, I don't have any experience.
One other problem with having your own bean bag is that once it is filled it becomes very heavy unless you use buckwheat which you cannot get in Kenya. Carrying two heavy molar bags between camps is a big pain.
The only other time I found the bags useful is if you are standing up and shooting out of the top at a distant subject or a leopard/bird in a tree above you and you need to be absolutely still for a long time. The top bars are not padded and the bag makes it much easier.
One issue that often comes up with resting a camera/lens combo on a bean bag over a window sill/bar is that panning is difficult as the lens foot does not move so well. Option here as has been suggested is a monopod head or another is two Wimberley M-1 quick release arms (from the flash assembly system) that clamp on either side of the lens foot. A bit pricey but lightweight and actually works very well. I've used this for many years with bigger lenses that I have trouble handholding for long. ...Show more →
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guitardirky wrote:
You may want to check in on what type of vehicle that you may be using. The ones that are open sided don't always have a place for a beanbag. My last trip I did everything handheld or with a monopod.
Thanks for all of this information - seems like taking my own bean bag is not necessary. The camp in Kenya is set up for photographers so they will probably have plenty of support provided or equipped in the vehicles. Not sure about Tanzania, but I can certainly manage without a bean bag I think. I also appreciate the advice on the other options for stability - espcially since they are lightweight and simple.
I am glad that the concept of using a monopod was brought up as well and using it in an inverted manner outside the vehicle is possibly not allowed, I am wondering how people get those amazing low level shots. Some of the recent images from Kenya here on FM have been flat out incredible and shot from low or ground level. I would love to hear more about how people are achieving this. One post from earlier in the thread shows an image of the photographer using a DJI Ronin RS3 pro gimbal that gives some reach downward. That seems like a pretty good option (although adding more weight and complexity), although I wonder if using a lens longer than about 200mm is feasible with that kind of setup.
Thanks for all of this information - seems like taking my own bean bag is not necessary. The camp in Kenya is set up for photographers so they will probably have plenty of support provided or equipped in the vehicles. Not sure about Tanzania, but I can certainly manage without a bean bag I think. I also appreciate the advice on the other options for stability - espcially since they are lightweight and simple.
I am glad that the concept of using a monopod was brought up as well and using it in an inverted manner outside the vehicle is possibly not allowed, I am wondering how people get those amazing low level shots. Some of the recent images from Kenya here on FM have been flat out incredible and shot from low or ground level. I would love to hear more about how people are achieving this. One post from earlier in the thread shows an image of the photographer using a DJI Ronin RS3 pro gimbal that gives some reach downward. That seems like a pretty good option (although adding more weight and complexity), although I wonder if using a lens longer than about 200mm is feasible with that kind of setup. ...Show more →
You can get pretty low if you are willing to hang out the vehicle. Some vehicles have a door that is removable, so you can lay on the floor of the vehicle. Also, the perspective you observe in the image is a combination of the position of the lens, the position of the subject, and the distance from the subject. Often distances are such that the angle between subject and lens is not overly sharp.
berimbolo wrote:
You can get pretty low if you are willing to hang out the vehicle. Some vehicles have a door that is removable, so you can lay on the floor of the vehicle. Also, the perspective you observe in the image is a combination of the position of the lens, the position of the subject, and the distance from the subject. Often distances are such that the angle between subject and lens is not overly sharp.
Thanks - what you are saying about the perspective makes complete sense. Do you know if they always allow the doors to be removed if the vehicle has that option? That would be terrific.
Abuttolph wrote:
Thanks - what you are saying about the perspective makes complete sense. Do you know if they always allow the doors to be removed if the vehicle has that option? That would be terrific.
Not sure about the doors. We were unable to, but our vehicle was of a different type with a large door. I think the typical 3 row vehicles would allow doors to be opened. @artsupreme would have a more informed take on this.
Thanks for all of this information - seems like taking my own bean bag is not necessary. The camp in Kenya is set up for photographers so they will probably have plenty of support provided or equipped in the vehicles. Not sure about Tanzania, but I can certainly manage without a bean bag I think. I also appreciate the advice on the other options for stability - espcially since they are lightweight and simple.
I am glad that the concept of using a monopod was brought up as well and using it in an inverted manner outside the vehicle is possibly not allowed, I am wondering how people get those amazing low level shots. Some of the recent images from Kenya here on FM have been flat out incredible and shot from low or ground level. I would love to hear more about how people are achieving this. One post from earlier in the thread shows an image of the photographer using a DJI Ronin RS3 pro gimbal that gives some reach downward. That seems like a pretty good option (although adding more weight and complexity), although I wonder if using a lens longer than about 200mm is feasible with that kind of setup. ...Show more →
You do this if/when you are able. Otherwise, an inverted monopod would work but it would be harder to control the body and see the LCD. I was hanging out lower/farther than this from the floor of another vehicle which is more inverted/awkward when I found myself face to face with that male Lion who came at me for a sniff. Canon 100-300 for reference, screen shots from phone video:
berimbolo wrote:
Not sure about the doors. We were unable to, but our vehicle was of a different type with a large door. I think the typical 3 row vehicles would allow doors to be opened. @artsupreme@ would have a more informed take on this.
It depends on the type of vehicle and doors, and also who you are with. For most of the "open" vehicles that don't have your typical car sized doors and windows/frames they'll have the tiny little entry door to step in/out, say 2'x2' or less. In these types of vehicles, I very carefully open the door, lay on the floor, and hang out the side. If you are with other people, they might not like you opening the door because of the sound it makes and it can creek from squeaky hinges. I would say most people aren't going to be able to do this unless you are sharing a private vehicle with just a couple of photographers in there. For most open vehicles I see with 4+ people, you are pretty limited to your seat/row and you would be best just using a cushion on the floor to get on your knees and hang over the side as much as possible.
