p.22 #1 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
How do you guys imagine the returns are being handled at Camera Quest? Am I just going to receive the one Fred returned? or do the returns get sent back to the manufacturer for replacement? Now I'm getting concerned that the 50% of good copies from camera quest are gone
p.22 #2 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
I am sending my 15/4 III lemon back tomorrow to Camera Quest and will ask them what happens to my defective lens. I will also point them to this thread where the issues of my lens are documentd. If their policy isn't to return a defective lens to the manufacturer then I will not buy from them again.
As I don't know what their policy is, I am imviting them to state their policy here clearly on this forum.
p.22 #5 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
My past experience with Stephen at Cameraquest is that he's very communicative, so anyone interested in buying from him should feel free to send him an email prior.
p.22 #6 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
jhinkey wrote:
My past experience with Stephen at Cameraquest is that he's very communicative, so anyone interested in buying from him should feel free to send him an email prior.
p.22 #7 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
Stephen is a class act and is quite active, over many years, supporting us and providing unique products. He would not still be in business if he recirculated defective products.
ruffellprefley wrote:
How do you guys imagine the returns are being handled at Camera Quest? Am I just going to receive the one Fred returned? or do the returns get sent back to the manufacturer for replacement? Now I'm getting concerned that the 50% of good copies from camera quest are gone
p.22 #8 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
Stephen at Cameraquest is an awesome guy. He replaced my E-mount...no questions asked. You are dealing with the owner and he is very responsive.
I don't think it's difficult to find a good copy. Some will get a perfect copy right away and others may have to try a couple times. This thread makes is look like most copies are bad and that is not reality. Photographers with bad copies seem to be more vocal about it.
p.22 #9 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
I still wonder ultmately how CV is going to deal with what appears to be around a 50% rejection rate if what we are seeing here on FM is representative of the lens production.
p.22 #11 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
good to know about the high quality of service at camera quest. since I went through Amazon and not CQ directly I'm sure my return would go back through AZ, but I'll still email Stephen if I need to return. thanks for the awesome work in this thread too
p.22 #12 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
Fred Miranda wrote:
I don't think it's difficult to find a good copy. Some will get a perfect copy right away and others may have to try a couple times. This thread makes is look like most copies are bad and that is not reality. Photographers with bad copies seem to be more vocal about it.
I think that's probably true most of the time on the internet, but I doubt it's the case here.
We're not talking about people that had a problem, googled it, found this thread and signed up to post their results here. We're talking about people that were already here participating prior to getting their copy and then reporting on it when theirs came in. From those people, we're what, 3 for 12 on good copies or something like that? Too small to draw a conclusion on yet but we're batting well under .500 I think.
p.22 #13 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
I ordered on Friday from Cameraquest through Amazon and I received it today. Just took some sample shots mostly at 5.6. Not sure I took them right to test but want to make sure it's not terrible as I will be taking this to Rio and Peru this week and have no time to exchange.
If anyone can take a look and tell I should appreciate. To me, it looks fine even though corners are not as sharp as center. The weather here is terrible and is going stay like this until I leave.
Link at Flickr. I just uploaded OOC jpegs without any editing.
p.22 #14 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
From what I can see the first 3 shots ignore because the focus point is not in those areas but further away. But the rest you are more flat to a wall or object and they look pretty good. It's tough because the light is yuk. But your almost flat wall shot even though your close looks pretty good. Obviously like to see better light, on tripod and get a good corner infinity but so far it looks pretty good.
Btw Amazon is a 30 day return so when you get back you can test it again or maybe you can do it on your trip and you will have time to return if need be.
p.22 #15 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
GMPhotography wrote:
Agree here in the states its pretty good but honestly after one return on a product , I would be hard pressed to the hit dealer again on a second time. Its not there fault and these returns cost money. Case in point , I overnighted my GM 85 to my dealer last week and it cost me 125 dollars, Im not getting reimbursed for that and that money would certainly take my family out to a decent meal.
Ouch, how on earth does it cost $125 to ship back?
However for that exact reason I greatly prefer buying in-store in person when I pick up a new lens. I will typically unbox and test a lens before paying and leaving the store, however this only filters out true duds (such as some of the copies we have seen in this thread) and not the 'OK-but-not-as-good-as-it-could-be' copies that require a more regimented test process to flush out (eg fine detail at infinity) than what you can shoot in a store environment.
Trying to return a bad copy of a lens at all is a big hit and miss game in Australia. Only a couple of retailers offer a no questions asked returns policy, and mostly the rest will adhere to Australian consumer law which allows for a refund or exchange in the case of the lens having a major fault; unfortunately few retailers would agree soft corners constitutes a major fault. Our consumer law does allow for 'minor faults' to be repaired at no cost to the consumer, however this is not always a great outcome as it may mean a long wait for repairs on something you have just purchased.
I am not sure I would risk buying this lens from an Australian retailer unless I had an iron clad guarantee from them that I could swap bad copies.
p.22 #17 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
Aztatlan wrote:
Ouch, how on earth does it cost $125 to ship back?
However for that exact reason I greatly prefer buying in-store in person when I pick up a new lens. I will typically unbox and test a lens before paying and leaving the store, however this only filters out true duds (such as some of the copies we have seen in this thread) and not the 'OK-but-not-as-good-as-it-could-be' copies that require a more regimented test process to flush out (eg fine detail at infinity) than what you can shoot in a store environment.
Trying to return a bad copy of a lens at all is a big hit and miss game in Australia. Only a couple of retailers offer a no questions asked returns policy, and mostly the rest will adhere to Australian consumer law which allows for a refund or exchange in the case of the lens having a major fault; unfortunately few retailers would agree soft corners constitutes a major fault. Our consumer law does allow for 'minor faults' to be repaired at no cost to the consumer, however this is not always a great outcome as it may mean a long wait for repairs on something you have just purchased.
I am not sure I would risk buying this lens from an Australian retailer unless I had an iron clad guarantee from them that I could swap bad copies....Show more →
Australia consumer law defines a major fault as one such that, if you knew about it, you would not have bought it.
I find that if I cite this to a retailer, they cave and accept returns if it close to when I bought it.
Not fun to have to do though - you have to act like a smart alec bush lawyer.
p.22 #18 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
DavidBM wrote:
Australia consumer law defines a major fault as one such that, if you knew about it, you would not have bought it.
I find that if I cite this to a retailer, they cave and accept returns if it close to when I bought it.
Not fun to have to do though - you have to act like a smart alec bush lawyer.
You are right, however under that fairly vague definition there would be no distinction in the eyes of most consumers between a major and minor fault. If "would you have still bought the item, had you known about the fault?" is the litmus test for major vs minor faults, I struggle to think of many examples of faults that would not bother me enough to dissuade me from purchasing an item.
I, too have had some luck arguing ACL to a retailer to get an exchange of a faulty lens on more than one occasion. However it was a drawn out and unpleasant process and as the law does not make a clear and unambiguous distinction between major and minor, many retailers exploit this to the detriment of the consumer.
Both times I had to argue for a refund/replacement of a faulty lens, the retailer tried to push for repairs for "minor" faults. The first was a clearly decentered Zeiss 21 ZF.2 and the store wanted to send it back to Germany for servicing. They deemed the fault not major as the lens still functionally took photos (no matter that half the frame was laughably soft apparently.) I baulked at this but after a protracted argument I got a refund.
The second time related to a faulty VR unit in a Nikon lens; also argued as "minor" by the store but again what rational consumer would knowingly buy a lens with a faulty VR unit? Retailer argued that as the lens was "mostly" functional it was a minor fault and that it was up to Nikon to repair it; again eventually got a refund but it wasn't pretty and took many weeks.
p.22 #19 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
I wanted to give another positive shout out for Stephen Gandy at Camera Quest.
While I am not happy that I got a bad copy of the CV 15mm FE, I am happy to say that Stephen provided a pre-paid shipping label for it's return.
Clearly not Camera Quests fault that Voigtlander is shipping bad copies, but Stephen is making good by it.
I would strongly encourage anyone who is going to give this lens a try to buy directly from Camera Quest as they give an extra level of service that you don't get from the big NY retailers.
p.22 #20 · Official: Voigtlander 15mm f/4.5 III E-mount
Aztatlan wrote:
You are right, however under that fairly vague definition there would be no distinction in the eyes of most consumers between a major and minor fault. If "would you have still bought the item, had you known about the fault?" is the litmus test for major vs minor faults, I struggle to think of many examples of faults that would not bother me enough to dissuade me from purchasing an item.
I, too have had some luck arguing ACL to a retailer to get an exchange of a faulty lens on more than one occasion. However it was a drawn out and unpleasant process and as the law does not make a clear and unambiguous distinction between major and minor, many retailers exploit this to the detriment of the consumer.
Both times I had to argue for a refund/replacement of a faulty lens, the retailer tried to push for repairs for "minor" faults. The first was a clearly decentered Zeiss 21 ZF.2 and the store wanted to send it back to Germany for servicing. They deemed the fault not major as the lens still functionally took photos (no matter that half the frame was laughably soft apparently.) I baulked at this but after a protracted argument I got a refund.
The second time related to a faulty VR unit in a Nikon lens; also argued as "minor" by the store but again what rational consumer would knowingly buy a lens with a faulty VR unit? Retailer argued that as the lens was "mostly" functional it was a minor fault and that it was up to Nikon to repair it; again eventually got a refund but it wasn't pretty and took many weeks. ...Show more →
Oh yes I didn't say it was fun. It's very unpleasant, and puts me off buying lenses at home. Frankly, Id rather pay fifty bucks to send it back to Adorama than fight with these guys. (I had an FE 90 that I had to fight for a replacement with Digidirect who wanted to send it to Sony). But they do buckle, because the law is on your side.
