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Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review

  
 
RustyBug
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p.8 #1 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


rji2goleez wrote:
The thing is, if we have to look this closely to find differences, and those differences are so subtle and small, it's a win for the Simera.


+1

Optically ... too close to call
Haptics ... personal preference

Budget vs. Size / Handling seems to be the most significant diff's, not IQ.



Nov 10, 2024 at 02:09 PM
1bwana1
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p.8 #2 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


rji2goleez wrote:
The thing is, if we have to look this closely to find differences, and those differences are so subtle and small, it's a win for the Simera.


I was very near biting the bullet and getting the latest generation 50mm leica Lux. But I think this will work for me just as well. I am looking forward to B&H shipping my copy soon. The last they said it is supposed to be around the 11th.

Edited on Nov 10, 2024 at 04:07 PM · View previous versions



Nov 10, 2024 at 02:19 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.8 #3 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


I really wish Thypoch would have copied the 35 Lux FLE so closley.


Nov 10, 2024 at 02:29 PM
highdesertmesa
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p.8 #4 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


RustyBug wrote:
+1

Optically ... too close to call
Haptics ... personal preference

Budget vs. Size / Handling seems to be the most significant diff's, not IQ.


I would say flare is the biggest difference. Just my two cents that the Lux flare is much more cinematic and appealing. The flare shots into the sun with the Lux in Fred's tests evoke a positive emotion to me, whereas the non-flaring Simera is just documentary in feel.



Nov 10, 2024 at 02:55 PM
serhan_
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p.8 #5 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


You can add a mist filter if you want the flaring affect:
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1695216/0&year=2021#15557502

highdesertmesa wrote:
I would say flare is the biggest difference. Just my two cents that the Lux flare is much more cinematic and appealing. The flare shots into the sun with the Lux in Fred's tests evoke a positive emotion to me, whereas the non-flaring Simera is just documentary in feel.





Nov 10, 2024 at 03:04 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.8 #6 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


highdesertmesa wrote:
I would say flare is the biggest difference. Just my two cents that the Lux flare is much more cinematic and appealing. The flare shots into the sun with the Lux in Fred's tests evoke a positive emotion to me, whereas the non-flaring Simera is just documentary in feel.



I agree. Depending on the lighting, the Lux produces more veiling, adding a bit more character, while still offering modern rendering with excellent SA correction, no outlining, and smooth transitions. The Simera, however, is better at controlling flare, giving it a slightly more clinical appearance and in some cases higher overall contrast.



Nov 10, 2024 at 03:07 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.8 #7 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


I still need to test for focus shift, optical vignetting (specular highlight shape), and chromatic aberration, but the answer can already be found in many of these rendering samples.


Nov 10, 2024 at 03:12 PM
Steve Spencer
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p.8 #8 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


nehemiahphoto wrote:
I really wish Thypoch would have copied the 35 Lux FLE so closley.


My guess is that Thypoch wanted more consistency between the 35mm and 50mm given they are part of the same set of cine lenses too. To my eye the 35 lux Asph FLE doesn't look much like the 50 lux Asph, so it seems they may have tried to create a consistent look and they went with the look of the 50 lux Asph as a template. If that is what they did, then the 50 would be a very close replica of the 50 lux Asph, but the 35 although clearly based on the lens design from the 35 lux Asph FLE, appears to have been tweaked more and perhaps those tweaks were to try to make it look more like the 50 (and therefore the 50 lux Asph).



Nov 10, 2024 at 03:18 PM
rji2goleez
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p.8 #9 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


RustyBug wrote:
+1

Optically ... too close to call
Haptics ... personal preference

Budget vs. Size / Handling seems to be the most significant diff's, not IQ.


I don't mind the haptics at all. Then again, I've never shot the 50 Summilux!



Nov 10, 2024 at 03:29 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.8 #10 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


Steve Spencer wrote:
My guess is that Thypoch wanted more consistency between the 35mm and 50mm given they are part of the same set of cine lenses too. To my eye the 35 lux Asph FLE doesn't look much like the 50 lux Asph, so it seems they may have tried to create a consistent look and they went with the look of the 50 lux Asph as a template. If that is what they did, then the 50 would be a very close replica of the 50 lux Asph, but the 35 although clearly based on the lens design from the
...Show more

Good thought Steve but not sure I agree. From what we are seeing from Fred, this 50/1.4 is pretty high contrast (aside from flare interference)--maybe not quite as high as the 50 Lux, but pretty similar with a better midzone. The 50 Lux and 35 Lux (you have owned both, but tell me if you disagree) are both quite high contrast WO, especially centrally.

The 35/1.4 Simera is soft WO. My copy, even centrally, shot on a modded sensor or Stock, had pretty diminished contrasts. Resolution was fine.

So, to my mind, we have 3 of 4 lenses with quite high contrast WO, and one outlier. Having said that, your theory might hold and be right with the other aspecs from Thypoch--like flare, bokeh with the rounded many blades, etc.

We see they already dropped the horrible infinite lock. So there is inconsistency there already. I just think they released a not great 35mm, and they are learning as they go, as many newer companies do.

Makes me wonder what the 75mm will shoot like.

And now that I think about it, what Thypoch did reminds me a bit of the ZA 35/1.4 and ZA 50/1.4, with one being much high contrast than the other.



Nov 10, 2024 at 04:35 PM
 


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philip_pj
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p.8 #11 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


The replacement of the silver front ring with black, removal of the infinity lock and the focus tab bodes well for how they handle user feedback. That's refreshing, and build quality way exceeds the price level. I don't see a Z-mount version yet at B&H, but when released it should be of great interest to Nikon Zf users.


Nov 10, 2024 at 04:42 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.8 #12 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


nehemiahphoto wrote:
Good thought Steve but not sure I agree. From what we are seeing from Fred, this 50/1.4 is pretty high contrast (aside from flare interference)--maybe not quite as high as the 50 Lux, but pretty similar with a better midzone. The 50 Lux and 35 Lux (you have owned both, but tell me if you disagree) are both quite high contrast WO, especially centrally.

The 35/1.4 Simera is soft WO. My copy, even centrally, shot on a modded sensor or Stock, had pretty diminished contrasts. Resolution was fine.

So, to my mind, we have 3 of 4 lenses with quite high
...Show more

They have very similar output, making the Simera a more affordable alternative to the Leica 50mm f/1.4 Summilux ASPH. (v1 and v2). The main differences are that the Leica is slightly sharper at the center, while the Simera is a bit sharper in the mid-zone, and they have different flare characteristics. The mid-field resolution difference is more noticeable at infinity, but I see less of a difference at closer distances.

I'm now curious about the Simera 28mm and 35mm and might review them too. I really appreciate the mechanical depth of field.



Nov 10, 2024 at 04:45 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.8 #13 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


I really enjoy exchanging ideas with fellow FM members while working on my reviews. Our community is full of knowledgeable and experienced people, and their insights help me get the big picture. It’s truly a collaborative process that always shows in my final thoughts.


Nov 10, 2024 at 04:47 PM
Sonnar-7
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p.8 #14 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


Fred Miranda wrote:
They have very similar output, making the Simera a more affordable alternative to the Leica 50mm f/1.4 Summilux ASPH. (v1 and v2). The main differences are that the Leica is slightly sharper at the center, while the Simera is a bit sharper in the mid-zone, and they have different flare characteristics. The mid-field resolution difference is more noticeable at infinity, but I see less of a difference at closer distances.

I'm now curious about the Simera 28mm and 35mm and might review them as well. I love the mechanical depth of field.


The flare of the Summilux Asph gives some more cinematic character(although I prefer the flares of the Pre-Asph) but the more visible structure in the bokeh of the Simera can give it an edge too in that regard.

The less corrected SA of the Nokton 50mm 1.2 gives some halation and subtle glow on lights that can be lacking in the cinematic feel of the Summilux and Simera, the bokeh of the Nokton being more smooth than the one of the Simera where I would give the edge to the Simera since I’m not fond of butter.

The Nokton vs the Simera could be an interesting match though.

And it feels that it would be easy for Thypoch considering all that to make an Eureka 50mm 1.4 to rival and surpass the Summilux pre-Asph.



Nov 10, 2024 at 04:57 PM
highdesertmesa
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p.8 #15 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


serhan_ wrote:
You can add a mist filter if you want the flaring affect:
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1695216/0&year=2021#15557502


The mist filters don't produce same flare character of the Lux, especially the flare of the previous non-close-focusing version. The filters are too uniform and too neutral in color. The Lux flare is unique, with warm amber-red flare tone, including the red ring flare.



Nov 10, 2024 at 05:36 PM
philip_pj
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p.8 #16 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


'Thypoch' is not a new company. They are a DZOFILM sub-brand. This information is very hard to find in the reviews of the Thypoch lenses, quite remarkable that no one wanted to know their background. In this short video interview:

https://www.newsshooter.com/2024/09/13/dzofilm-simera-c-first-look/

..Matthew Allard asks the DZOFILM representative about the new SImera-C cine versions, from 0:20 the rep states:

'..that we announce under the new sub-brand of DZOFILM. It's called Thypoch. Its main focus is on the photography lenses for Leica M-mount and the other mirrorless mounts', 'Simera comes from the existing photo lenses that we have developed', 'it's like a rehousing of ourselves'.

DZOFILM is itself a part of a larger initiative - DZOOPTICS, which is part of DZO GROUP. The 'DZO' (dee-zee-oh) comes from (D)ong(Z)heng (O)ptical, located in Shenzhen. DZOOPTICS started off in 2013, DZOFILM in 2019.

'After more than ten years of technological innovation and market development, the company has gradually formed machine vision imaging (DZOPTICS®), film and media (DZOFILM®), consumer optics (Thypoch®) as the main business areas.'



Nov 10, 2024 at 06:03 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.8 #17 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


Sonnar-7 wrote:
The flare of the Summilux Asph gives some more cinematic character(although I prefer the flares of the Pre-Asph) but the more visible structure in the bokeh of the Simera can give it an edge too in that regard.

The less corrected SA of the Nokton 50mm 1.2 gives some halation and subtle glow on lights that can be lacking in the cinematic feel of the Summilux and Simera, the bokeh of the Nokton being more smooth than the one of the Simera where I would give the edge to the Simera since I’m not fond of butter.

The Nokton vs the
...Show more

Great summary! However, I don't notice much difference in the structure, even when comparing them side by side with the same lighting and framing. I agree there is a difference, but it's very subtle and would be hard to spot without a direct comparison. Overall, I consider both the Simera and Leica lenses to be well-corrected, modern designs.



Nov 10, 2024 at 07:38 PM
cbass
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p.8 #18 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


I don't notice any meaningful differences either. It is impressive the Simera can keep up wide open and draws like the Summilux. I wonder if Leica at some point will get annoyed and try to sue.


Nov 10, 2024 at 10:58 PM
Steve Spencer
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p.8 #19 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


nehemiahphoto wrote:
Good thought Steve but not sure I agree. From what we are seeing from Fred, this 50/1.4 is pretty high contrast (aside from flare interference)--maybe not quite as high as the 50 Lux, but pretty similar with a better midzone. The 50 Lux and 35 Lux (you have owned both, but tell me if you disagree) are both quite high contrast WO, especially centrally.

The 35/1.4 Simera is soft WO. My copy, even centrally, shot on a modded sensor or Stock, had pretty diminished contrasts. Resolution was fine.

So, to my mind, we have 3 of 4 lenses with quite high
...Show more

After reviewing more pictures from the Simera 35, I think you are right that it really has fairly low contrast even in the center and in that way it is quite different from the Leica M 35 lux Asph FLE, the Leica 50 lux Asph, and the Simera 50 f/1.4. Thanks for pointing that out. If Thypoch was aiming for a similar look for the 35 f/1.4 and 50 f/1.4 Simera then they really didn't achieve that for contrast, perhaps in bokeh and perhaps in more even performance across the frame, but not in contrast which I find pretty crucial.

I really like what I see in this review of the 50 f/1.4 Simera and as always I find Fred has done an excellent job in giving a feel for that lens in this review. I always liked the 50 lux Asph despite its weaknesses (propensity to flare, mid zone softness at narrower apertures, and sawtooth bokeh balls at times) and I think I would like the Simera optically at least as much.

I never fully took to the 35 lux Asph FLE. It was a great lens for contrast in the center especially, but for me the bokeh was too structured (i.e., harsh) at times and the transition zone often wasn't smooth. I also was bothered more by its midzone weakness on the M10. Still I loved its ergonomics and there is a lot to like about this lens even though I found myself wanting an alternative.

It does not look like the Simera 35 f/1.4 will be that alternative. Hopefully Fred will do a full review of that lens and I will know for sure, but it sure doesn't look like I will be interested.

My favorite 35mm that I have used by a pretty big margin is the Zeiss ZM 35 f/1.4, but it is pretty big on a Leica M camera. I am enjoying shooting manual focussing lenses on my Sony A7r V at the moment, however, and I think I might really like that lens on a Kolari modified Sony (especially if I get my A7r V modified at some point). Right now I am using a CV 40 f/1.2 on my Sony A7r V, which I like but has some annoying weaknesses (mainly more axial CA than I like and weaker close up performance than I like).

I am waiting to see if a 35mm for a Leica M camera comes along that I like better. If it does I may in a few years acquire a Leica M10R or M11, but if it doesn't then I will probably just get my Sony A7r V modified with a thin sensor stack and go with the Zeiss ZM and in the mean time live with my CV 40 f/1.2.



Nov 11, 2024 at 07:43 AM
Adamwilbert
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p.8 #20 · Thypoch Simera 50mm f/1.4 ASPH. Review


How’s the balance on the camera?

I picked up the Voigtlander 50mm apo (similar dimensions and weight) but it’s a bit front heavy on a strap and tips forward when the camera is on a table.



Nov 11, 2024 at 09:55 AM
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