Fred Miranda wrote:
It's also worth remembering that most of these early reviewers are hand selected by Leica. The written reviewers often receive pre production or beta gear directly from Leica, so they are naturally part of that early access circle. Even if they genuinely try to be fair, that kind of close relationship can make it hard to be fully critical, at least publicly.
And realistically, if someone is consistently harsh or overly critical, it's hard to imagine they will keep getting early gear the next time around.
And they would never have been selected if they hadn’t gushed over Leica publicly and consistently for quite a while.
And if they weren’t blind to some inconsistencies in what they say (like all those 28mm shooters who praise Leica for the ability to see outside the frame, while at 28mm the frame is totally filled; or the guys heralding the rangefinder while shooting mostly at 21mm with an external finder…).
Personally I am not interested in f/1.2 or f/1.4 lenses that are overly large and heavy because of the way I photograph. When I walk around Paris on a daily basis I want a camera + lens that is relatively small and light. Photographing scenes dusk, dawn and nighttime it is nice to have a f/1.2 and f/1.4 in the arsenal, both for the extra light gathering capabilities but also for the look. I've used the CV 40/1.2 and I appreciate the rendering. It doesn't mean I shoot everything at f/1.2 but it is nice to have the option - you can always stop down a f/1.2 lens but not the other way around if you carry a f/2 or f/4 lens...
KLaban wrote:
Oh Lord, please save us from influencers!
There have always been influencers, we just didn't call them that. Commentators, opinion pieces, food or restaurant critics, car magazines doing test of new cars, some ski magazine testing new gear, authors and journalists...
Today's technology has made it so that everyone can have and share an opinion, and the way new media is consumed there are new genres opinons and content.
I do agree that we all consume this content with critical eyes, and all knwo and understand that people reviewing this new Leica lens were hand picked by Leica product development and/or marketing, but then again, when I see some of the images produced by these early testers, in most cases I really apprecaite their talent and willingness to share them.
patotts wrote:
There have always been influencers, we just didn't call them that. Commentators, opinion pieces, food or restaurant critics, car magazines doing test of new cars, some ski magazine testing new gear, authors and journalists...
Today's technology has made it so that everyone can have and share an opinion, and the way new media is consumed there are new genres opinons and content.
I do agree that we all consume this content with critical eyes, and all knwo and understand that people reviewing this new Leica lens were hand picked by Leica product development and/or marketing, but then again, when I see some of the images produced by these early testers, in most cases I really apprecaite their talent and willingness to share them.
Fred Miranda wrote:
It's also worth remembering that most of these early reviewers are hand selected by Leica. The written reviewers often receive pre production or beta gear directly from Leica, so they are naturally part of that early access circle. Even if they genuinely try to be fair, that kind of close relationship can make it hard to be fully critical, at least publicly.
And realistically, if someone is consistently harsh or overly critical, it's hard to imagine they will keep getting early gear the next time around.
agree 100%.
However pictures that aren't AI manipulated are what they are, and some of the nighttime images in this last clip posted above make me lean towards getting the 35 noctilux irrespective of the the reviewers thoughts.
I'm thinking the 35 noctilux could be a replacement for my 35 APO inasmuch as I don't care about its edge to edge sharpness and would enjoy the better (by how much?) subject/background separation of the 35 noctilux. But I'm not sure if I'm willing to deal with the added weight/size of the 35 noctilux as well as its lack of focus tab (which someone suggested was omitted because the lens is already wide as it is).
My logical brain says I should wait until objective reviewers like Fred have put the 35 noctilux through its paces and opined on comparisons between it and the 35 APO. My lizard brain says get it as soon as possible.
Definitely has that noctilux look for lack of better words, different enough from the lux family to my eyes. It seems to place a modern rendering into a 3D space, can't help but to think the regular 35 FLE looked flatter in comparison...
Logically speaking it'll be dumb for Leica to design a lens that's only little brighter and charge a premium, glad they make it a unique enough identity, seems like it's a specialized tool just like the 50mm siblings.
I won't be able to afford this for a long time, but seeing the pictures I start to understand the Noctilux identity more now, maybe one day when a used one shows up with the right price tag I'll join the club. 🫣
Definitely has that noctilux look for lack of better words, different enough from the lux family to my eyes. It seems to place a modern rendering into a 3D space, can't help but to think the regular 35 FLE looked flatter in comparison...
Logically speaking it'll be dumb for Leica to design a lens that's only little brighter and charge a premium, glad they make it a unique enough identity, seems like it's a specialized tool just like the 50mm siblings.
I won't be able to afford this for a long time, but seeing the pictures I start to understand the Noctilux identity more now, maybe one day when a used one shows up with the right price tag I'll join the club. 🫣...Show more →
For some reason I love this video. I even watched it in Chinese.
The rendering reminds me a lot of the Sigma 35/1.2 or Sony 35/1.4 GM, very modern, super smooth, almost 'too perfect'. And I don't mean that as a knock at all, most people love this look. It's also pretty wild Leica pulled this off in such a compact lens.
The Leica 50/0.95, while better corrected than the older Noctilux models, still has a distinctive look compared to other modern lenses. I keep hearing the new Leica 35/1.2 Noct described as having the "Noctilux look" (from Leica's marketing, reviewers, and all), but to me that mostly refers to the amount of blur, not the drawing style. It feels quite different from my 50/1 and 50/1.2 (or LLL) Nocts, and even from the more corrected 50/0.95. If anything, the 75/1.25 seems like a closer match signature-wise.
Just my personal take as someone who nerds out over rendering. I'm not loyal to the red dot, I am loyal to the emotion certain lenses can evoke. My favorite 35mm is still the 35/1.4 FLE for exactly that reason.
Of course, everyone sees these lenses differently, but this is just how I see it.
Fred Miranda wrote:
For some reason I love this video. I even watched it in Chinese.
The rendering reminds me a lot of the Sigma 35/1.2 or Sony 35/1.4 GM, very modern, super smooth, almost 'too perfect'. And I don't mean that as a knock at all, most people love this look. It's also pretty wild Leica pulled this off in such a compact lens.
The Leica 50/0.95, while better corrected than the older Noctilux models, still has a distinctive look compared to other modern lenses. I keep hearing the new Leica 35/1.2 Noct described as having the "Noctilux look" (from Leica's marketing, reviewers, and all), but to me that mostly refers to the amount of blur, not the drawing style. It feels quite different from my 50/1 and 50/1.2 (or LLL) Nocts, and even from the more corrected 50/0.95. If anything, the 75/1.25 seems like a closer match signature-wise.
Just my personal take as someone who nerds out over rendering. I'm not loyal to the red dot, I am loyal to the emotion certain lenses can evoke. My favorite 35mm is still the 35/1.4 FLE for exactly that reason.
Of course, everyone sees these lenses differently, but this is just how I see it....Show more →
Fred,
Have a feel how the 35/2 V4 KOB might compare to this new 35? I sold my Leica 50/1.2 in favor of keeping the LLL 50/1.2, but that's just me.
stgrove wrote:
Fred,
Have a feel how the 35/2 V4 KOB might compare to this new 35? I sold my Leica 50/1.2 in favor of keeping the LLL 50/1.2, but that's just me.
I hear you. When I say 50/1.2 Noct, I'm talking about the LLL 50/1.2 1966 as well. I personally prefer its rendering over the Leica remake. I have not tried the original 50 f/1.2 AA, but I"ve seen plenty of images from it.
As for the 35/2 V4 KOB,,I haven't used one, but my guess is it won't produce images similar to the Leica 35/1.2 at f/2. The "King of Bokeh" title was given to the 35/2 V4 back in the 90s, when ultimate bokeh meant a unique, character‑filled signature, not just overly smooth, abstract perfection. It is funny and ironic that Leica later borrowed the name and actually called the very imperfect 35/1.4 Steel Rim reissue the "true" KOB! it's all marketing.
I agree but it's probably due to less aberrations affecting how much the subject blends in or out of the focus plane gradient. Especially cleaner edges really pronounce the "tridimensional effect" [saw this on one of the websites lol, they just making up terms] The central APO characteristic was a very good compromise to enhance this affect.
Definitely has that noctilux look for lack of better words, different enough from the lux family to my eyes. It seems to place a modern rendering into a 3D space, can't help but to think the regular 35 FLE looked flatter in comparison...
Logically speaking it'll be dumb for Leica to design a lens that's only little brighter and charge a premium, glad they make it a unique enough identity, seems like it's a specialized tool just like the 50mm siblings.
I won't be able to afford this for a long time, but seeing the pictures I start to understand the Noctilux identity more now, maybe one day when a used one shows up with the right price tag I'll join the club. 🫣...Show more →
Designers have a fair degree of control regarding the appearance of the focal plane area these days. It's great seeing Leica attend to the things that matter in the image - avoiding etching bokeh, smoothness of fall-off (focus, not outer frames like the Petapixel guy who thinks it's to be judged as a macro), enough CA correction, very hard to unsettle bokeh, with still apparent visual cues in it.
And it does not compare to the longer Nokt lenses, as it has a strong central area at around 70% of the fine detail lpmm, same as say, Loxia 85mm, Otus 55mm. I feel that is as much as they can get away without fancy spatial frequency treatments. They also have to smooth off edges of faces (5-10 lpmm) to avoid the cutout look, and also to ease the viewing eye into the in-focus region. Not easy, but important.
Influencers - and if you want the truth, we all are that to some degree, in forums and reviews - are vital in the modern day and it helps to see the gamut of them. You can use little rules to avoid the ones you don't like or trust. I axe anyone who:
mentions price more than once;
favors as gospel those horrible charts shot at around one metre distance;
does five minute 'unpackings';
is a lens ring fiddler sitting at a desk;
compares to totally different lenses (size-cost-target audience);
does not post very large numbers of images.
I still get a lot of viewings to do for lenses of interest, especially in Chinese (!) as they are more image-focused, like me. I am not interested in mere opinions (I have plenty of my own), but images are the key. If they gush too much, that's OK too, good to see in fact, just look past that at the substance. Still waiting for a serious 'found portrait' person to provide, 35mm is fine for people. Street is a good test, but it's really enviro portraits, less of persons as such.
Fred Miranda wrote:
For some reason I love this video. I even watched it in Chinese.
The rendering reminds me a lot of the Sigma 35/1.2 or Sony 35/1.4 GM, very modern, super smooth, almost 'too perfect'. And I don't mean that as a knock at all, most people love this look. It's also pretty wild Leica pulled this off in such a compact lens.
The Leica 50/0.95, while better corrected than the older Noctilux models, still has a distinctive look compared to other modern lenses. I keep hearing the new Leica 35/1.2 Noct described as having the "Noctilux look" (from Leica's marketing, reviewers, and all), but to me that mostly refers to the amount of blur, not the drawing style. It feels quite different from my 50/1 and 50/1.2 (or LLL) Nocts, and even from the more corrected 50/0.95. If anything, the 75/1.25 seems like a closer match signature-wise.
Just my personal take as someone who nerds out over rendering. I'm not loyal to the red dot, I am loyal to the emotion certain lenses can evoke. My favorite 35mm is still the 35/1.4 FLE for exactly that reason.
Of course, everyone sees these lenses differently, but this is just how I see it....Show more →
Hm, I'm not getting Sony 35GM vibes from this lens (which I've owned and used plenty), but too early to tell. I am indeed looking froward though to see an in-depth comparison between the Summilux 35 FLE and this Noctilux 35, both wide open and stopped down a bit.
Fred Miranda wrote:
For some reason I love this video. I even watched it in Chinese.
The rendering reminds me a lot of the Sigma 35/1.2 or Sony 35/1.4 GM, very modern, super smooth, almost 'too perfect'. And I don't mean that as a knock at all, most people love this look. It's also pretty wild Leica pulled this off in such a compact lens.
The Leica 50/0.95, while better corrected than the older Noctilux models, still has a distinctive look compared to other modern lenses. I keep hearing the new Leica 35/1.2 Noct described as having the "Noctilux look" (from Leica's marketing, reviewers, and all), but to me that mostly refers to the amount of blur, not the drawing style. It feels quite different from my 50/1 and 50/1.2 (or LLL) Nocts, and even from the more corrected 50/0.95. If anything, the 75/1.25 seems like a closer match signature-wise.
Just my personal take as someone who nerds out over rendering. I'm not loyal to the red dot, I am loyal to the emotion certain lenses can evoke. My favorite 35mm is still the 35/1.4 FLE for exactly that reason.
Of course, everyone sees these lenses differently, but this is just how I see it....Show more →
That Chinese video is making me want one. I don’t need a 1.2 lens for street but that type of portraiture use is ideal. Due to the lack of funds I’ll make do with my Asph preFLE 35mm Summilux.
patotts wrote:
Hm, I'm not getting Sony 35GM vibes from this lens (which I've owned and used plenty), but too early to tell. I am indeed looking froward though to see an in-depth comparison between the Summilux 35 FLE and this Noctilux 35, both wide open and stopped down a bit.
Comparing the Leica 35mm f/1.4 Lux FLE to the 35mm f/1.2 Noct may seem subtle at first, depending on background complexity, distance, etc... However, once you pay attention to how each renders, the difference is clear...(I'm sure someone with both will post a comparison soon). The Noct's rendering and focus transition are much smoother wide open and at f/1.4, with minimal outlining in highlights, while the FLE has that classic, structured Leica character, modern yet timeless. Its tint leans slightly toward magenta, but that's easy to tweak in post.
It's a bit like comparing the Leica 50/1.4 Lux ASPH with the pre-ASPH version, where most of the difference comes down to CA correction and rendering characteristics.
If you have a Sony 35/1.4 GM or Sigma 35/1.2, two of the best fast 35mm lenses out there, a side-by-side with the 35/1.2 Noct might surprise you with how similar they are in overall rendering. Saying a Leica looks like a Sony or Sigma might raise eyebrows, but it's actually meant as a compliment. I also suspect that the blur difference between f/1.2 and f/1.4 on the Noct is minimal.
Like many other lens manufacturers, Leica is designing their latest lenses with ever more perfection (correction) in mind, which makes sense. The irony is that as everyone goes in this direction, images are starting to look more alike than they did in the past...
I consider myself lucky that I'm no longer drawn to the pursuit of perfection and prefer the charm of imperfect brushes.
I also suspect that the blur difference between f/1.2 and f/1.4 on the Noct is minimal.